Ask a Question - or - Return to the Spiritual Warfare Forum Index

Question Title Posted By Question Date
A disturbing character on a Catholic thread Lisa Thursday, February 10, 2005

Question:

I am a member of the Catholic answers forum and as you know from previous threads I am active in the pro-life ministry.On the forum anyone is welcome as long as they abide by forum rules(which is good because of the fruit of conversions).

I posted in a thread and was debating a so-called rational intellectual type who was trying to defend abortion, evry time I looked at his name I would get a most unsettling feeling of oppression,I can't describe it with words.The name was Tlaloc, I felt compelled to look the name up because of strong negative feelings I was having everytime I saw it. It turns out it was a demonpagon god of the aztechs that had infant and children sacrifices made to it.Our Lady of Guadeloupe interceded on behalf of the aztechs and got them away from that mess.

I confronted the poster and he admitted he knows the background and has made many attacks on Our Lady, our Church and even called God a liar.The mods have pulled a thread because of the persons antics and I pray for him.

My questions are this 1)Is Tlaloc an actual demon or an atribute of a demon?

2)His posts most of the time are very subtle evil in nature,should I ignore them or respond?

3)Other posters even Catholics defend the call name because they say Tlaloc wasn't real,how do I deal with that assertion?

I Believe the evil behind Tlaloc was very real or Our Lady would not have been so integral and even miraculous in her intercession.The nature of his call name and the nature of his post are eerily similar.

What are your suggestions,brother?

Also, if you do have time to send me some prayers of protection concerning the abortion mill with the santeria priestess I would gladly welcome them.God Bless You

PS I thank God for his generosity with your mom:) Our prayers were answered in a most glorious way,and I hope you are feeling better too.



Question Answered by Bro. Ignatius Mary, OLSM

Dear Lisa:

Concerning Question #1: Tlaloc is a rain god of the Aztecs. Human sacrifices were offered to this rain god. It does not matter whether this rain god named Tlaloc was merely a mythical god or a demon. Most likely Tlaloc is both.

Concerning Question #2:  Such a person, with such a screen name is obviously present on a Christian message board for the purposes of disruption and baiting. Thus it is best that you not respond to this person. Rather, pray for him.

Concerning Question #3: To defend the use of this screen name on the assertion that Tlaloc is not real is frankly stupid. It does not matter if Tlaloc is real. The worship of Tlaloc, even if only a mythical god, was real. The human sacrifices to this false god was real. And a demonic presence at these human sacrifices was real.

In addition, the motivation of the person using this screen name must be taken into consideration as well as their behavior. From what you have said this person was obviously not in the Catholic Answer Forums for good purposes.

When I populated chatrooms and message boards I would immediately place on ignore any person with a blasphemous, immoral, digusting, offensive, or otherwise inappropriate screen names. I would do this immediately and thus refused to "entertain" them.

The Bible says: "Answer not a fool according to his folly, lest you be like him yourself. Answer a fool according to his folly, lest he be wise in his own eyes" (Proverbs 26:4-5)


Here is information about this Aztec god from the website of new ager Ellie Crystal's Metaphysical and Science Website.

DISCLAIMER: Often the best place to find the "scoop" on things like this is from the "horse's mouth" sort-to-speak -- that is, to find out how the people who are into this stuff define the issues. This is what I found about Tlaloc from Ellie's website (this is not to imply I recommend her website. Please do not visit her site out of curiosity. One can get into spiritual trouble doing that. Visiting sites like hers should only be done by people with legitimate research purposes. Curiosity KILLS the cat.

TLALOC, the rain deity: The name may be Aztec, but the idea of a storm god especially identified with mountaintop shrines and life-giving rain was certainly as old as Teotihuacan. 

The primary temple of this major deity was located atop Mt. Tlaloc, where human victims were sacrificed to fertilize water-rocks within the sacred enclosure. In Tenochtitlan another Tlaloc temple shared the platform atop the dual Main Pyramid, a symbolic mountain.


TLALOCAN: Tlalocan was the earthly paradise of Tlaloc, located in the East, the place of Light and Life. It was where the souls of those killed by lightning, dropsy, skin diseases, and those sacrificed to Tlaloc went.

The Rain God-God of Vegetation-Ruler of the South. In ancient Chichimec times may have been worshipped under the name of Tlalocateuctli, meaning "Land-lier-Lord". Tlalocateuctli was considered by Alcaron to be a metaphor for the owner of a sown field.

Known to the Olmec as "Epcoatl", meaning Seashell Serpent. There is speculation that this deity originated with the Olmec. Known to the Maya as Chac, to the Totonacs as Tajin, to the Mixtecs as Tzahui, to the Zapotecs as Cocijo and throughout Mesoamerica.

A water god probably one of the oldest gods worshiped as a result of the importance of rain for crop production. Called Choc by the Maya and Cocijo by the Mixtecs, the principal worship god of the Olmec culture. Tlaloc was not a creator God but one created by other Gods. His first wife Xochiquetzal, Goddess of flowers and love , was stolen from him by Tezcatlipoca. His second wife was the Goddess Matlolcueitl, "The Lady of the Green Skirts", an ancient name for the mountain known as Malinche, located in Tlaxcala.

Although a beneficent god Tlaloc certainly had the power to unleash floods, lightning and drought when angry. To please him children were sacrificed to him as well as prisoners dressed in his image. It is said that the more the babies and children cried the more Tlaloc was pleased. During the sacrifice the tears of the screaming children were seen as representations of falling rain, the more the children cried, the better the rain season.

Tlaloc is easily identified by his characteristic mask giving the impression of eyeglasses and a mustache. Blue is his dominant color and of his mask. His body and face are often painted black, and water is often depicted dripping from his hands. The name Tlaloc, derives from the term "tlalli", meaning earth, with the suffix "oc", meaning something that is on the surface. Townsend alludes to the fight of clouds welling up in canyons and hovering around mountaintop in the rainy season to explain this metaphor.

Those who died from drowning, lightning or things thought to be associated with water went to Tlacocan, the paradise of Tlaloc located in the South and was known as the place of fertility.

His home in Tenochtitlan was next to the same temple of the venerated Huitzilopochtli, where a special chamber was built. His statue was made of stone in the shape of a horrible monster. The image was dressed in red with a green feather headdress. A string of green beads called chalchihuitl, "jade", hung from his neck. His ears, arms, and ankles were adorned with bracelets of precious stones. Apparently no other idols in the Mexica city were adorned with as many precious jewels at Tlaloc. In his right hand was a representation of a purple wooden thunderbolt, in his left hand was a leather bag filled with copal. The idol was placed upon a green cloth draped over a dais. His body was sculpted as a man and the face like a monster.

Known as Epcoatl, (Seashell Serpent), to the Olmec, and his religious themes were associated with children with that culture as well.

Also known as Tlalteuctli, (Earth Lord). May have been known as Oztoteotl, (The God of Caves), who was principally worshipped in the Chalma area. In the codex Vaticanus, Tlaloc is depicted as living inside of a mountain.

Known by the Olmec as "Epcoatl", or Seashell Serpent.

An interesting ceremony to Tlaloc by his priests was for the priests to throw themselves into frigid lake waters at midnight and imitate the sound and splashing of water birds to the point of exhaustion. This was apparently done just to please Tlaloc. In another ritual a priest would climb a mountain naked and painted black, carrying fir boughs and a conch trumpet. He would chew tobacco and periodically blow the horn. After piercing his ears and thighs with spines to let blood, he would retrace his steps stumblin.

The direction of the rains Tlaloc sent were also of importance. The western rain was red colored from the sunset. This rain represented the richness of autumn. The southern rain was a rich blend of rain and summer fertility and considered a , Tlaloc's color.

The eastern rain was a golden rain which fell lightly over the crops making the crops grow, a promise of life. The north rain was a hail and thunder message from Tlaloc often bringing destruction. Snow and hail were thought of as representations of the bones of the past dead.

The temple to Tlaloc, on Mt. Tlaloc, is approximately at the 4000 meter level with views of the twin volcanoes Popocatepetl and Ixtaccihuatl and the entire valleys of Pueblo and Mexico. Mt. Tlaloc was located approximately twenty-five miles due east of Tenochtitlan and directly north of the twin volcanoes. In the Spring, at the height of the dry season, the leaders of Tenochtitlan, Tetzcoco, Tlacopan, and Xochimilco would make a pilgrimage to the shrine to call for rain from within the mountain.

While the Mexica leaders were conducting their ceremony, a large tree called "Father", or Tota, was erected near the great shrine to Tlaloc in Tenochtitlan and surrounded with small trees to symbolize a forest. An impersonator of Chalchiuhtlicue, Goddess of the sea and lakes, was selected to sit in the forest and symbolize the lake. As the leaders were returning, the great tree was felled and rafted out to the Pantitlan shrine, located in the center of the lake, where a great fleet of canoes met the returning leaders. The impersonator was then sacrificed, her blood poured into the water of the lake, jewelry given to the water of the lake, and the tree symbolically planted to indicate a renewal of life and growth. The tree was left to stand with the remains of trees planted in past years ceremonies.

Attendants of Tlaloc:

Resided in the mountains, where rain and clouds are formed. Not deities themselves but close enough. May be likened to devilish imps who served the rain god Tlaloc. The Tlaloque were worshiped in special ceremonies during the sixteenth month of the Aztec calendar, (Dec. 11-Dec. 30), known as Atemoztli, meaning "The Descent of Water".

The Tlaloque were the bearers of the rattlestaff (chicahualilizti), "That Which Makes Things Strong". A signification of a male erect penis or a type of digging stick.

The Tlaloque numbered four and lived in the halls of the great palace of Tlaloc, Tlalocan, the terrestrial paradise, and represented the four directions. On Tlaloc's orders one of the Tlaloque would take a particular jug and pour it over the world, thunder was thought to be the sound of the jugs breaking. The Mexica considered the Tlaloque to be brothers to the goddess of corn.

God Bless,
Bro. Ignatius Mary


For information on how to receive help see our Help page. We suggest that before contacting us directly for help you try the Seven Steps to Self-Deliverance. These self-help steps will often resolve the problem. Also our Spiritual Warfare Prayer Catalog contains many prayers that may be helpful. If needed you can ask for a Personal Consultation.