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Question Title	Posted By	Question Date
Judaism and prayer to the saints	Elizabeth	Wednesday, February 20, 2008
Question: Growing up with Catholic school teaching, I thought ( I definitely could be wrong) I learned that Jews asked for saints intercession and that we as Catholics carried over this tradition from the old to the new covenant. Tonight at school we had a Reformed Jewish speaker who said that Jews talk only directly to God and there are no considered saints, but there are biblical role models. My questions are 1) Do any types of Jews (orthodox, conservative or reformed) consider intercession acceptable? 2) Where did our intercession of the saints originate/originally come from... in other words, how did prayer with the saints start? Thanks Bro. Ignatius!
Question Answered by Bro. Ignatius Mary, OLSM Dear Elizabeth: There are some small hints of heavenly intercessory prayer in the Old Testament, such as in Tobit 12:12 where the angels take Tobit and Sarah's prayer to God. Other than such obscure hints like that there is no belief among the Jewish faith, that I am aware of, that would be comparable to the Christian doctrine of the Communion of the Saints. The Christian doctrines of the Communion of the Saints (praying for the intercession of the saints) comes from the teachings of Christ and the Apostles. It is not unexpected for this to develop only after the coming of Jesus. The Jews held a significant, but initiatory and incomplete Revelation of God. Jesus completed that Revelation and brought us a more extensive and mature and complete understanding of Divine Truths. The New Testament Revelation is "more complete" than the Old Testament, but is not ultimately complete. The fullness of the Revelation God has for His people will not come until the end of Salvation History and our eternal destiny in heaven. The development of the Communion of the Saints is derived from both Sacred Tradition and Sacred Scripture. The idea begins with the idea of the Body of Christ. We are all part of His Body -- those in heaven, those in purgatory, and those here on earth. Since no part of Christ's Body is amputated or paralyzed members of the Body have some form of communication with each other, with the all the family members. The nature of that communication is what we call the Communion of the Saints for which we ask the Saints (our family members, that is, our brothers and sisters who have gone before us) for their intercessions. The Catholic Encyclopedia has an article that explains the history and development of the Communion of the Saints. Another article on Prayer is good to read too. Thomas Aquinas addresses the issue of whether or not the Saints hear our prayers in the Summa Theologica, Question 72. Prayers with regard to the saints in heaven. God Bless, Bro. Ignatius Mary Footer Notes: This forum is for general questions on the faith. See specific Topic Forums below: Spiritual Warfare, demons, the occult go to our Spiritul Warfare Q&S Forum. Liturgy Questions go to our Liturgy and Liturgical Law Q&A Forum Liturgy of the Hours (Divine Office) Questions go to our Divine Office Q&A Forum Defenfing the Faith Questions go to our Defending the Faith Q&A Forum Church History Questions go to our Church History Q&A Forum

Question Title

Posted By

Question Date

Judaism and prayer to the saints

Elizabeth

Wednesday, February 20, 2008

Question:

Growing up with Catholic school teaching, I thought ( I definitely could be wrong) I learned that Jews asked for saints intercession and that we as Catholics carried over this tradition from the old to the new covenant. Tonight at school we had a Reformed Jewish speaker who said that Jews talk only directly to God and there are no considered saints, but there are biblical role models.

My questions are 1) Do any types of Jews (orthodox, conservative or reformed) consider intercession acceptable?

2) Where did our intercession of the saints originate/originally come from... in other words, how did prayer with the saints start?

Thanks Bro. Ignatius!

Question Answered by Bro. Ignatius Mary, OLSM

Dear Elizabeth:

There are some small hints of heavenly intercessory prayer in the Old Testament, such as in Tobit 12:12 where the angels take Tobit and Sarah's prayer to God.

Other than such obscure hints like that there is no belief among the Jewish faith, that I am aware of, that would be comparable to the Christian doctrine of the Communion of the Saints.

The Christian doctrines of the Communion of the Saints (praying for the intercession of the saints) comes from the teachings of Christ and the Apostles. It is not unexpected for this to develop only after the coming of Jesus. The Jews held a significant, but initiatory and incomplete Revelation of God. Jesus completed that Revelation and brought us a more extensive and mature and complete understanding of Divine Truths. The New Testament Revelation is "more complete" than the Old Testament, but is not ultimately complete. The fullness of the Revelation God has for His people will not come until the end of Salvation History and our eternal destiny in heaven.

The development of the Communion of the Saints is derived from both Sacred Tradition and Sacred Scripture. The idea begins with the idea of the Body of Christ. We are all part of His Body -- those in heaven, those in purgatory, and those here on earth. Since no part of Christ's Body is amputated or paralyzed members of the Body have some form of communication with each other, with the all the family members. The nature of that communication is what we call the Communion of the Saints for which we ask the Saints (our family members, that is, our brothers and sisters who have gone before us) for their intercessions.

The Catholic Encyclopedia has an article that explains the history and development of the Communion of the Saints. Another article on Prayer is good to read too.

Thomas Aquinas addresses the issue of whether or not the Saints hear our prayers in the Summa Theologica, Question 72. Prayers with regard to the saints in heaven.

God Bless,
Bro. Ignatius Mary

Footer Notes: This forum is for general questions on the faith. See specific Topic Forums below:
Spiritual Warfare, demons, the occult go to our Spiritul Warfare Q&S Forum.
Liturgy Questions go to our Liturgy and Liturgical Law Q&A Forum
Liturgy of the Hours (Divine Office) Questions go to our Divine Office Q&A Forum
Defenfing the Faith Questions go to our Defending the Faith Q&A Forum
Church History Questions go to our Church History Q&A Forum