Ask a Question - or - Return to the Faith and Spirituality Forum Index

Question Title Posted By Question Date
Saints Ryan Saturday, January 12, 2013

Question:

Hi Brother.

There are those who claim that there are Saints in our history who may have been collections of various traditions solidified into one person that may not even have existed. I suppose one example they may cite would be St. Iosaphat, whose story Catholic Encyclopedia admits is "a Christianized version of one of the legends of Buddha." 

They will also cite stories, such as that of St. Remy, which include the earth swallowing up a mill, so as to imply that many of these stories and traditions are hyper-fantastical and imply more so embellished hagiography than any grounding in Truth. This seems to be part of the crux of why they cannot accept the Catholic Faith. They also seem to point out that the nature of the change of canonization from largely popular leverage to a more standardized "top-down" Papal oriented approval system creates a kind of split in the tradition of declaring Saints, which would create a problem for many of these supposedly spurious Saints because how could it be that someone by a name may not have even existed, and yet he is a Saint (possibly from a time before the Church took firmer hold on these proceedings), and yet the Church claims to be infallible in its proclamations of canonization as well as its sustenance of Saints not formally canonized?

How are we to understand this? There was also mention that one alleged Saint was actually a dog. I do not remember the name given for that one, but perhaps you may know something about this.

In the course of my own research, individual stories of the Saints and apparitions are the least of which I have scrutinized. This is mostly because I think Church history as well as Public Revelation are far more important than these individual issues. The drawback to this, however, is that I do not seem to have a good answer as to why so many of these traditions, and even apparently some Saints, seem so ridiculous.

In a secular institution (university) I do not feel like I am losing my faith by a long shot, for I know too much already to let such trivialities challenge the Rock of the True Faith, but I do feel incompetent at evangelizing others in this horribly secular environment. I feel like an evangelical failure, and this is beginning to concern me a lot. Perhaps there may be a bit of pride in this in that I may fall into expectations of myself to be some kind of evangelical hero, but it is hard for me to help feeling like I am failing to represent God and His Church efficiently.

I would certainly, as usual, appreciate help on this topic.



Question Answered by Bro. Ignatius Mary, OMSM(r), LTh, DD

Dear Ryan:

Well, these detractors to the Church, again and as usual, misinterpret and fail to understand the issues. The Church does not claim infallibility of pre-canon saints. It is only in the formal canonization that infallibility exists. 

As to the fantastic legends and folklore that surrounds from Saints (pre or post canon), the Church fully discloses the differences between what we know to be true about the Saints, what we think may be true, and what is pure legend. When decided who will be a Saint, the Church does not consider any legends or folklore. It looks to credible facts of the person's life, and to verifiable instances of miracles attributed to the candidate-Saint, which is required as part of the process of Sainthood.

In modern times we have all sorts of folklore, legends, and mthys about St. Nicholas. We collectively refer to these legends as Santa Claus. The fact that such myth develops around a real person does not diminish the life of the real person. And, when under investigation for sainthood the Church looks to what can be known the person, not the legends, myths, and folklore.

The Church also fully discloses that some of the Saints listed in the Roman Martyrology may not have actually existed. These Saints remain on the list as an historical reference, as whether they existed or not, it was thought by people, in times past, that they did exist and therefore did offer veneration.

Concerning veneration to a Saint that may not have existed, my response is "so what?" If a person has a devotion to a Saint that probably did not exist for whatever reason is God going to take that pilgrim's prayers and deposit them in the waste can? Of course not. God honors the faith of the person, and that, is what veneration of the Saints is all about anyway.

In the case of St. that you mentioned, the text of that article goes on to say that despite the legend, it is still "of historical value, since it contains the "Apology" presented by the Athenian philosopher Aristides to the Emperor Adrian (or Antoninus Pius), thus it remains in the Roman Martyrology for historical reasons. There is no claim to infallibility here.

The Patron Saint of this Internet Apostolate is St. Dallan.  The legend surrounding St. Dallan is he was beheaded and his head was re-attached to his body. We have chosen St. Dallan as the Patron Saint of our Internet Apostolate because of the severe attacks, verbal beatings, calumnies, libels, false innuendos, defamation of character, and other insults we receive every day in the Internet Apostolate. The reason for these attacks is that we proclaim the Truth of Christ, and the Truth of the Catholic Church in uncompromising  loyalty to the Magisterium and Pope of the Catholic Church. Since many do not wish to hear the truth and wish to re-invent the Church in their own image, they, in effect, behead us when we attempt to stand for truth in the face of their errors. We must then, reattach our head and keep moving forward for the cause of Christ and Church.

To put it bluntly, I do not care whether or not that legend is true; and it is not likely to be true. That is not the point. We were attracted to the story for the reasons given as they represent a meaning to us that is very apropos. This is part of the reason for myth—to make a point using both facts and fiction. Today we call this a "docudrama".

Concerning evangelizing others, always remember that the reason people will obsess over minutia is that they are either looking for any little ammunition to prove their bigotry, or the are looking for any little excuse to not consider the Catholic Church.

While we must do what we can to educate these numskulls, there is a limit. St. Paul instructs us, "But avoid stupid controversies, genealogies, dissensions, and quarrels over the law, for they are unprofitable and futile" (Titus 3:9).

God Bless,
Bro. Ignatius Mary

 


Footer Notes: This forum is for general questions on the faith. See specific Topic Forums below:
Spiritual Warfare, demons, the occult go to our Spiritul Warfare Q&S Forum.
Liturgy Questions go to our Liturgy and Liturgical Law Q&A Forum
Liturgy of the Hours (Divine Office) Questions go to our Divine Office Q&A Forum
Defenfing the Faith Questions go to our Defending the Faith Q&A Forum
Church History Questions go to our Church History Q&A Forum