Ask a Question - or - Return to the Faith and Spirituality Forum Index

Question Title	Posted By	Question Date
Is sexual pleasure in marriage sinful?	Catherine	Saturday, June 27, 2009
Question: I'm researching an issue that has come up at my parish women's prayer group. Your forum helped, but there are some tough issues we need help with. We realize there is one, holy, apostolic and Catholic church and that there are not supposed to be division as, say, in Judiasm (orthodox, conservative, reform). Unfortunately, some of our group follow the 'orthodox' teaching (biblical, etc., from catholic planet and other sites). In addition to debates on veils and the roles of women as EM's, the issue of what is permissable in married sex came up. And as in one question, I also recall being taught that ALL sex in marriage was sinful and had to be confessed, even though the couple wanted to have a child (St. Augustine?) and that marital pleasure was inherently sinful. Also that seeing one's own body was always sinful, even in the bath. One member of the group put forth that nudity between spouses was also sinful at all times, that even during the marriage act, there should be covering and darkness, for to gaze upon each other's nakedness was lustful. She quoted the one about a man loving his wife too much was no better than an adulterer and added that spouses must love each ther as Christ loved the church (chastely). No, then, to massages, candelit bubblebaths, pretty (not obscene) lingerie, or sexual playfulness between a man and wife in private. Even sensual kissing was out---because our mouths were made to glorify the Lord, not be sexually defiled. Oh and a woman enjoying sex? That was not her place. We allowed her to speak---that was her right, but many of us are troubled. Where does it say God does not wish couples to enjoy each other? According to some of the teaching this woman follows, even touching a spouse's genital region in foreplay is gravely immoral, that only missionary position is allowed and that couples should pray before and after sex for forgiveness of their lust! Have you any insight? Or are we all Jezebels in our marriages?
Question Answered by Bro. Ignatius Mary, OLSM Dear Catherine: Well, I'd have to say that you have a group that has some pretty disordered ideas about the marital embrace. In fact, to suggest that the body is evil, which is what is implied in saying the sex is sinful in marriage, is a heresy. How can the body, or marital sex be sinful? God made the human body, God invented sex, God blessed the marital union, God says that marriage is a good thing, God made marriage a Sacrament, God says the purpose of marriage is to procreate. Does God tell us to do something that is evil? Does God create evil? To look upon the naked body of one's spouse is also not a sin. That is utterly silly. Again, to suggest such a thing is saying that the body is shameful and intrinsically evil. That is a heresy. And, to look upon one's spouse is NOT lust. This gal needs an education. (From the Catholic Dictionary) Lust is "an inordinate desire for or enjoyment of sexual pleasure. The desires or acts are inordinate when they do not confirm to the divinely ordained purpose of sexual pleasure, which is to foster the mutual love of husband and wife and, according to the dispositions of providence, to procreate and educate their children. To have desire for one's spouse, to look upon one's spouse which arises desire is not lust. Such desire is not "inordinate" but natural and proper within marriage. Nudity, fore-play, intercourse, after-play, enjoying one another in love and the sexual faculty are God ordained. Nothing God ordains is sinful. The sexual union of a husband and wife is actually an image of the relationship of Christ and His Bride. The Bible uses the marital union to illustrate the profound union of Christ with the Church, His Bride. Chastity is indeed part of marriage. Chastity in marriage is, of course, to remain faithful to one's spouse, but it is far more than that. Chastity in marriage means that the marital embrace is a mutual self-giving to one another. Thus, for example, a wife refusing relations with her husband to punish or manipulate him is unchaste, a violation of the sexual faculty. A husband insisting on relations with his wife when she does not wish it is also unchaste, a violation of the sexual faculty. Also, certain sexual practices are unchaste within marriage when they degrade the human person, such as sado-masochism or bondage among a few other practices that are unspeakable. The marital embrace is to be a mutual self-giving to one another in love. It is the expression of love that is so powerful that it produces another human being. This is part of the image of God that we all are. The love between the Father and the Son was so profound that it became the Holy Spirit. Bishop Fulton Sheen gave this reflection: The Holy Spirit in the Trinity The Father loves the Son and the Son loves the Father. Love is not in one alone; love is not in the other. The love that we have for one another is not just in me and not just in you. Love is always a bond between two or among several. That is why even lovers will speak of our love, something outside of the lovers themselves. So love is not in the Father, love is not in the Son, love is the mysterious bond uniting both. Because we are here dealing with the infinite, that divine love is so deep, so profound that it cannot express itself by canticles, words, or embraces. It can express itself only by that which signifies the fullness of exhaustion of all giving, namely, a sigh. Something that's too deep for words. That is why the bond of love between the Father and the Son is called the Holy Breath, the Holy Spirit (spirit means breath). As the three angles of the triangle do not mean three triangles, but one, so there are three persons or three relationships in God, but only one God. God Bless, Bro. Ignatius Mary Footer Notes: This forum is for general questions on the faith. See specific Topic Forums below: Spiritual Warfare, demons, the occult go to our Spiritul Warfare Q&S Forum. Liturgy Questions go to our Liturgy and Liturgical Law Q&A Forum Liturgy of the Hours (Divine Office) Questions go to our Divine Office Q&A Forum Defenfing the Faith Questions go to our Defending the Faith Q&A Forum Church History Questions go to our Church History Q&A Forum

Question Title

Posted By

Question Date

Is sexual pleasure in marriage sinful?

Catherine

Saturday, June 27, 2009

Question:

I'm researching an issue that has come up at my parish women's prayer group. Your forum helped, but there are some tough issues we need help with.

We realize there is one, holy, apostolic and Catholic church and that there are not *supposed* to be division as, say, in Judiasm (orthodox, conservative, reform). Unfortunately, some of our group follow the 'orthodox' teaching (biblical, etc., from catholic planet and other sites).

In addition to debates on veils and the roles of women as EM's, the issue of what is permissable in married sex came up. And as in one question, I also recall being taught that ALL sex in marriage was sinful and had to be confessed, even though the couple wanted to have a child (St. Augustine?) and that marital pleasure was inherently sinful. Also that seeing one's own body was always sinful, even in the bath.

One member of the group put forth that nudity between spouses was also sinful at all times, that even during the marriage act, there should be covering and darkness, for to gaze upon each other's nakedness was lustful. She quoted the one about a man loving his wife too much was no better than an adulterer and added that spouses must love each ther as Christ loved the church (chastely). No, then, to massages, candelit bubblebaths, pretty (not obscene) lingerie, or sexual playfulness between a man and wife in private. Even sensual kissing was out---because our mouths were made to glorify the Lord, not be sexually defiled. Oh and a woman enjoying sex? That was not her place.

We allowed her to speak---that was her right, but many of us are troubled.

Where does it say God does not wish couples to enjoy each other? According to some of the teaching this woman follows, even touching a spouse's genital region in foreplay is gravely immoral, that only missionary position is allowed and that couples should pray before and after sex for forgiveness of their lust!

Have you any insight? Or are we all Jezebels in our marriages?

Question Answered by Bro. Ignatius Mary, OLSM

Dear Catherine:

Well, I'd have to say that you have a group that has some pretty disordered ideas about the marital embrace.

In fact, to suggest that the body is evil, which is what is implied in saying the sex is sinful in marriage, is a heresy. How can the body, or marital sex be sinful? God made the human body, God invented sex, God blessed the marital union, God says that marriage is a good thing, God made marriage a Sacrament, God says the purpose of marriage is to procreate. Does God tell us to do something that is evil? Does God create evil?

To look upon the naked body of one's spouse is also not a sin. That is utterly silly. Again, to suggest such a thing is saying that the body is shameful and intrinsically evil. That is a heresy.

And, to look upon one's spouse is NOT lust. This gal needs an education. (From the Catholic Dictionary) Lust is "an inordinate desire for or enjoyment of sexual pleasure. The desires or acts are inordinate when they do not confirm to the divinely ordained purpose of sexual pleasure, which is to foster the mutual love of husband and wife and, according to the dispositions of providence, to procreate and educate their children.

To have desire for one's spouse, to look upon one's spouse which arises desire is not lust. Such desire is not "inordinate" but natural and proper within marriage.

Nudity, fore-play, intercourse, after-play, enjoying one another in love and the sexual faculty are God ordained. Nothing God ordains is sinful.

The sexual union of a husband and wife is actually an image of the relationship of Christ and His Bride. The Bible uses the marital union to illustrate the profound union of Christ with the Church, His Bride.

Chastity is indeed part of marriage. Chastity in marriage is, of course, to remain faithful to one's spouse, but it is far more than that. Chastity in marriage means that the marital embrace is a mutual self-giving to one another. Thus, for example, a wife refusing relations with her husband to punish or manipulate him is unchaste, a violation of the sexual faculty. A husband insisting on relations with his wife when she does not wish it is also unchaste, a violation of the sexual faculty.

Also, certain sexual practices are unchaste within marriage when they degrade the human person, such as sado-masochism or bondage among a few other practices that are unspeakable.

The marital embrace is to be a mutual self-giving to one another in love. It is the expression of love that is so powerful that it produces another human being. This is part of the image of God that we all are. The love between the Father and the Son was so profound that it became the Holy Spirit.

Bishop Fulton Sheen gave this reflection:

The Holy Spirit in the Trinity

The Father loves the Son and the Son loves the Father. Love is not in one alone; love is not in the other. The love that we have for one another is not just in me and not just in you. Love is always a bond between two or among several. That is why even lovers will speak of our love, something outside of the lovers themselves. So love is not in the Father, love is not in the Son, love is the mysterious bond uniting both. Because we are here dealing with the infinite, that divine love is so deep, so profound that it cannot express itself by canticles, words, or embraces. It can express itself only by that which signifies the fullness of exhaustion of all giving, namely, a sigh. Something that's too deep for words. That is why the bond of love between the Father and the Son is called the Holy Breath, the Holy Spirit (spirit means breath). As the three angles of the triangle do not mean three triangles, but one, so there are three persons or three relationships in God, but only one God.

God Bless,
Bro. Ignatius Mary

Footer Notes: This forum is for general questions on the faith. See specific Topic Forums below:
Spiritual Warfare, demons, the occult go to our Spiritul Warfare Q&S Forum.
Liturgy Questions go to our Liturgy and Liturgical Law Q&A Forum
Liturgy of the Hours (Divine Office) Questions go to our Divine Office Q&A Forum
Defenfing the Faith Questions go to our Defending the Faith Q&A Forum
Church History Questions go to our Church History Q&A Forum