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Question Title	Posted By	Question Date
the lord's prayer	Anthony	Saturday, February 21, 2009
Question: Dear Bro Ignatius, I was watching a programme on the religion channel yesterday and the pastor(pentecostal) said few things that baffled me: first he said saying the lord's prayer as a prayer is wrong that mathew 6:9 says pray in this manner or pray then like this and did not say we should pray it as a real prayer. secondly he said representing the holy spirit as a dove is wrong as well.Can you please shed some light on this. God bless.
Question Answered by Bro. Ignatius Mary, OLSM Dear Anthony: Well, you need to consider the source. Pentecostal theology is sorely lacking and very flawed. What this Pentecostal preacher said is ridiculous. It is true that the Lord's Prayer gives is an outline by which we can form all other prayers. For example, the Lord's Prayer can be outlined like this... praise and adoration to God ("Our Father who art in heaven, Hallowed by they name") acceptance and surrender to God's will ("Thy kingdom come. Thy will be done. On earth as it is in heaven.") petition for our needs ("Give us our daily bread") confession, contrition and petition for forgiveness ("And forgive us our trespasses, as we forgive those who trespass against us.") asking for God's help to resist temptation ("And lead us not into temptation") asking God to deliver us, free us from Satan's bondage ("But deliver us from evil") This outline can be used in a multitude of prayers that we offer to God. But, to say that the Scriptural words are not to be prayed itself as a prayer is nonsense. The Bible is filled with prayers that we may pray. The Psalms are prayers. One method of prayer is to pray Scripture. Jesus prayed using Scripture. This Pentecostal preacher's idea is weird, ignorant, and not supported by Scripture. As for the Holy Spirit represented as a dove, the Bible makes the point the the Holy Spirit descending like a dove in Matthew 3:16. The phrase "like a dove" does not mean what such a phrase means in English today. This phrase can be rendered in English as "in the appearance of a dove". This preacher, like many fundamentalist, Pentecostal, and other "bible Christians" are sorely ignorant of the Bible and hold many theological errors. Ignore this guy. God Bless, Bro. Ignatius Mary Footer Notes: This forum is for general questions on the faith. See specific Topic Forums below: Spiritual Warfare, demons, the occult go to our Spiritul Warfare Q&S Forum. Liturgy Questions go to our Liturgy and Liturgical Law Q&A Forum Liturgy of the Hours (Divine Office) Questions go to our Divine Office Q&A Forum Defenfing the Faith Questions go to our Defending the Faith Q&A Forum Church History Questions go to our Church History Q&A Forum

Question Title

Posted By

Question Date

the lord's prayer

Anthony

Saturday, February 21, 2009

Question:

Dear Bro Ignatius,
I was watching a programme on the religion channel yesterday and the pastor(pentecostal) said few things that baffled me: first he said saying the lord's prayer as a prayer is wrong that mathew 6:9 says pray in this manner or pray then like this and did not say we should pray it as a real prayer.

secondly he said representing the holy spirit as a dove is wrong as well.Can you please shed some light on this.

God bless.

Question Answered by Bro. Ignatius Mary, OLSM

Dear Anthony:

Well, you need to consider the source. Pentecostal theology is sorely lacking and very flawed. What this Pentecostal preacher said is ridiculous.

It is true that the Lord's Prayer gives is an outline by which we can form all other prayers. For example, the Lord's Prayer can be outlined like this...

praise and adoration to God ("Our Father who art in heaven, Hallowed by they name")
acceptance and surrender to God's will ("Thy kingdom come. Thy will be done. On earth as it is in heaven.")
petition for our needs ("Give us our daily bread")
confession, contrition and petition for forgiveness ("And forgive us our trespasses, as we forgive those who trespass against us.")
asking for God's help to resist temptation ("And lead us not into temptation")
asking God to deliver us, free us from Satan's bondage ("But deliver us from evil")

This outline can be used in a multitude of prayers that we offer to God. But, to say that the Scriptural words are not to be prayed itself as a prayer is nonsense. The Bible is filled with prayers that we may pray. The Psalms are prayers. One method of prayer is to pray Scripture. Jesus prayed using Scripture. This Pentecostal preacher's idea is weird, ignorant, and not supported by Scripture.

As for the Holy Spirit represented as a dove, the Bible makes the point the the Holy Spirit descending like a dove in Matthew 3:16. The phrase "like a dove" does not mean what such a phrase means in English today. This phrase can be rendered in English as "in the appearance of a dove".

This preacher, like many fundamentalist, Pentecostal, and other "bible Christians" are sorely ignorant of the Bible and hold many theological errors.

Ignore this guy.

God Bless,
Bro. Ignatius Mary

Footer Notes: This forum is for general questions on the faith. See specific Topic Forums below:
Spiritual Warfare, demons, the occult go to our Spiritul Warfare Q&S Forum.
Liturgy Questions go to our Liturgy and Liturgical Law Q&A Forum
Liturgy of the Hours (Divine Office) Questions go to our Divine Office Q&A Forum
Defenfing the Faith Questions go to our Defending the Faith Q&A Forum
Church History Questions go to our Church History Q&A Forum