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Question Title	Posted By	Question Date
The apple in the Garden & a thank you	Ron	Wednesday, November 12, 2008
Question: Dear Brother in Christ, First, I would like to thank you for your response to Mahina (Why God Doesn't Follow His Own Rules, 10-13-08). I certainly got an education out of that as I too believed that sacraments determined our state of grace; it has been a blessing to hear that sacraments keep our state of grace in line. I have never left the church and actually have not missed a Sunday Mass in at least a decade, however, I had been tempted to visit a Protestant fundamentalist church that I had seen on T.V. because of its "emotionality". Instead, I decided to learn more about the Roman Catholic Church (under the Pope, not the one in people's minds) to fill this void I had in my faith, but I have discovered that it was not emotions I was missing--it was truth and reason. Thank you for being part of that discovery... As for my question, in my search for understanding our Christian faith more fully I had visited some websites and I came upon one that stated that the Tree of Knowledge in the Garden of Eden was actually Satan, and, the so-called apple was actually, for a lack of a better term, Satan's sensuality. So when Eve partook in the fruit from the tree she partook in this sensuality, i.e. had sex with Satan. When she offered Adam the fruit, therefore, Adam had sex with Satan. So Adam and Eve were banned from the Garden, that is, fallen out of grace with God, because they disobeyed God in what would be in a most rebellious way. What do you think about this interpretation? It seems the fruit from the Tree of Knowledge represents something other than just an apple. Could "knowledge" possibly have symbolized adultery and sexual deviation? Certainly Christ's crucifixation, his sacrifice on the wooden cross, symbolizes the new Tree of the Garden of Eden, just as Christ is the new Adam (and of course the Virgin is the new Eve), but are we to investigate more than what is stated in Genesis? Is doing so a sin? Thank you for your time. God Bless.
Question Answered by Bro. Ignatius Mary, OLSM Dear Ron: I praise God that our ministry has been helpful to your faith. As for this unusual interpretation of the Fall of Man, the Church has a different and definitive view. The Serpent is the devil. The Tree of the Knowledge of good and evil is the reference-point for man's moral behavior in which Adam and Eve were not to partake. Adam and Eve were at the time living in perfect bliss in the knowledge of God's goodness; they were in a "state of holiness and justice" (Council or Trent, De peccato oringinali) and shared in the divine life (Luman gentium, 2; Catechism, 375). When we live in perfect knowledge of God's goodness there is no room for, or reason, to know evil. This will be the state we are returned to in heaven. As mentioned in the the Navarre Bible Commentary: The fact that mad had access to the "tree of the knowledge of good and evil" means that God left the way open to the possibility of evil in order to ensure a greater good -- the freedom which is man's endowment. By using his reason and following his conscience, man is able to discern what is good and what is evil; be he himself cannot make something good or evil. So, God's command to our first parents implies that they have a duty to recognize that they are creatures and have a duty to reverence and to respect goodness, as reflected in the laws of creation and in the dignity proper to man as a person. Were man to want to decide on good and evil for himself, ignoring the goodness God impressed on things when he created them, it would mean man wanted to be like God. Man is always being tempted toward absolute moral autonomy-- and he gives in to that temptation when he forgets that there exists a God who is the Creator and Lord of all, man included. "The tree of the knowledge of good and evil," John Paul II comments, "was to express and constantly remind man of the 'limit' impassable for a created beging" (Dominum et Vivificantem, 30). When Adam and Eve partook of the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil they sought to be like God. The devil appealed directly to this temptation in Genesis 3:4-5: You will not die. For God knows that when you eat of it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil. "Knowing and evil" refers not to a knowledge of the existence of evil, and certainly not to "sexual knowledge, but to take authority in deciding good and evil for oneself. That is how one "will be like God." Thus, our first parents not only rebelled and ate the fruit of the forbidden tree, but they sought to establish themselves as their own Gods. This is essentially what the New Age does. The New Age is the old age traced back to the Garden. The devil's words in Genesis 3:4-5 contain the three basic elements of the New Age and the source of the problems of humanity: 1) you will not die (e.g., reincarnation or some other regeneration philosophy) 2) you will be like God (e.g., become our own gods, ascended masters, enlightened ones) 3) you will have the authority to determine for ourselves good and evil (e.g., moral relativism) The interpretation that you read about is nonsense and is utterly inconsistent with the Biblical passages, biblical symbolism, and theology. God Bless, Bro. Ignatius Mary Footer Notes: This forum is for general questions on the faith. See specific Topic Forums below: Spiritual Warfare, demons, the occult go to our Spiritul Warfare Q&S Forum. Liturgy Questions go to our Liturgy and Liturgical Law Q&A Forum Liturgy of the Hours (Divine Office) Questions go to our Divine Office Q&A Forum Defenfing the Faith Questions go to our Defending the Faith Q&A Forum Church History Questions go to our Church History Q&A Forum

Question Title

Posted By

Question Date

The apple in the Garden & a thank you

Ron

Wednesday, November 12, 2008

Question:

Dear Brother in Christ,
First, I would like to thank you for your response to Mahina (Why God Doesn't Follow His Own Rules, 10-13-08). I certainly got an education out of that as I too believed that sacraments determined our state of grace; it has been a blessing to hear that sacraments keep our state of grace in line. I have never left the church and actually have not missed a Sunday Mass in at least a decade, however, I had been tempted to visit a Protestant fundamentalist church that I had seen on T.V. because of its "emotionality". Instead, I decided to learn more about the Roman Catholic Church (under the Pope, not the one in people's minds) to fill this void I had in my faith, but I have discovered that it was not emotions I was missing--it was truth and reason. Thank you for being part of that discovery...

As for my question, in my search for understanding our Christian faith more fully I had visited some websites and I came upon one that stated that the Tree of Knowledge in the Garden of Eden was actually Satan, and, the so-called apple was actually, for a lack of a better term, Satan's sensuality. So when Eve partook in the fruit from the tree she partook in this sensuality, i.e. had sex with Satan. When she offered Adam the fruit, therefore, Adam had sex with Satan. So Adam and Eve were banned from the Garden, that is, fallen out of grace with God, because they disobeyed God in what would be in a most rebellious way.

What do you think about this interpretation? It seems the fruit from the Tree of Knowledge represents something other than just an apple. Could "knowledge" possibly have symbolized adultery and sexual deviation?

Certainly Christ's crucifixation, his sacrifice on the wooden cross, symbolizes the new Tree of the Garden of Eden, just as Christ is the new Adam (and of course the Virgin is the new Eve), but are we to investigate more than what is stated in Genesis? Is doing so a sin?

Thank you for your time. God Bless.

Question Answered by Bro. Ignatius Mary, OLSM

Dear Ron:

I praise God that our ministry has been helpful to your faith.

As for this unusual interpretation of the Fall of Man, the Church has a different and definitive view. The Serpent is the devil. The Tree of the Knowledge of good and evil is the reference-point for man's moral behavior in which Adam and Eve were not to partake.

Adam and Eve were at the time living in perfect bliss in the knowledge of God's goodness; they were in a "state of holiness and justice" (Council or Trent, De peccato oringinali) and shared in the divine life (Luman gentium, 2; Catechism, 375). When we live in perfect knowledge of God's goodness there is no room for, or reason, to know evil. This will be the state we are returned to in heaven.

As mentioned in the the Navarre Bible Commentary:

The fact that mad had access to the "tree of the knowledge of good and evil" means that God left the way open to the possibility of evil in order to ensure a greater good -- the freedom which is man's endowment. By using his reason and following his conscience, man is able to discern what is good and what is evil; be he himself cannot make something good or evil. So, God's command to our first parents implies that they have a duty to recognize that they are creatures and have a duty to reverence and to respect goodness, as reflected in the laws of creation and in the dignity proper to man as a person. Were man to want to decide on good and evil for himself, ignoring the goodness God impressed on things when he created them, it would mean man wanted to be like God. Man is always being tempted toward absolute moral autonomy-- and he gives in to that temptation when he forgets that there exists a God who is the Creator and Lord of all, man included.
"The tree of the knowledge of good and evil," John Paul II comments, "was to express and constantly remind man of the 'limit' impassable for a created beging" (Dominum et Vivificantem, 30).

When Adam and Eve partook of the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil they sought to be like God. The devil appealed directly to this temptation in Genesis 3:4-5:

You will not die. For God knows that when you eat of it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil.

"Knowing and evil" refers not to a knowledge of the existence of evil, and certainly not to "sexual knowledge, but to take authority in deciding good and evil for oneself. That is how one "will be like God."

Thus, our first parents not only rebelled and ate the fruit of the forbidden tree, but they sought to establish themselves as their own Gods. This is essentially what the New Age does. The New Age is the old age traced back to the Garden. The devil's words in Genesis 3:4-5 contain the three basic elements of the New Age and the source of the problems of humanity:

1) you will not die (e.g., reincarnation or some other regeneration philosophy)

2) you will be like God (e.g., become our own gods, ascended masters, enlightened ones)

3) you will have the authority to determine for ourselves good and evil (e.g., moral relativism)

The interpretation that you read about is nonsense and is utterly inconsistent with the Biblical passages, biblical symbolism, and theology.

God Bless,
Bro. Ignatius Mary

Footer Notes: This forum is for general questions on the faith. See specific Topic Forums below:
Spiritual Warfare, demons, the occult go to our Spiritul Warfare Q&S Forum.
Liturgy Questions go to our Liturgy and Liturgical Law Q&A Forum
Liturgy of the Hours (Divine Office) Questions go to our Divine Office Q&A Forum
Defenfing the Faith Questions go to our Defending the Faith Q&A Forum
Church History Questions go to our Church History Q&A Forum